1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. There seems to be a problem with some alerts not being emailed to members. I have told the hosts and they are investigating.
    Dismiss Notice
Welcome to the UK Betting Forum. Please consider registering, it is free!

Justice for punters org.

Discussion in 'Useful Stuff' started by mick, Feb 21, 2016.

  1. markfinn

    markfinn Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2015
    Messages:
    3,009
    Likes Received:
    5,779
    Morning Mick - nice article - but that's all it is, its just another sad indictment of modern life and could just as easily if not more forcefully and certainly with more facts and figs be made if it was referring to off licences and petrol stations, local post offices etc - the one thing different here is the FOB's and free drinks WC's etc they encourage users to hang around .

    Fruit Machines have long been the companion to the lonely figure in the pub, the person that sometimes seems to be on the edge of society. These FOB's with their incredible endless burn rate and increased offer of quick return will only expand feelings of desperation or isolation when it inevitably goes wrong. Ther has been talk recently of we are moving to a more robotic world and that will effect employment - the case is silently proved your attached article.

    What no one is asking is where is the money coming from ? . The Government is complicit in all this, they are reaping tax revenue on what looks to be an industry that is at least partly funded by crime

    How these betting machines can swallow a day's wage in 10 minutes

    The Church of England demands action on bet machines | Daily Mail Online

    This wont be a popular statement - but until we as a population accept that, if we want to return to country that has a Police presence walking the streets - old fashioned waste collection's - educational school classes of max 25 children that are all the same level on basic three R's etc etc we have to pay be willing to pay less for unearned income but also more income tax - at source not add on tax - we need a transparent system.
     
    mick likes this.
  2. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    Have n't seen this before - maybe because I don't search the forum exhaustively.
    I 'm going to apply for membership.
     
    nicksar and mick like this.
  3. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    Subbed to the justice for punters forum.
    It's interesting, deserves support.
    But it has only 147 members and they seem to have started it some time in Feb 2016.
    It should become further known.
    I wrote some things but they say they publish after moderation so I wait. I don't agree with this modus operandi of theirs - it makes things safe for the forum owner but kills conversation, inhibits participation. It's no good.

    Let me tell you about my experience with right2bet, some 7 years ago:
    This is group was formed in 2008 and they also made the series of comic videos "the renegade ref" - a satire of prohibitionism.
    Right2bet seems to have started in 2008 and they wanted to counter the prohibitionist laws in USA and France.
    But the exchanges were banned in both USA and France.
    I found out about them from a Belgian forum friend in 2009 and became involved but gradually I gained the impression that they were disappointed and eventually they abandoned it, in 2010 or 2011.
    In the brief time I was involved with right2bet I advised them thus:
    You should operate as a centre and appoint bloggers in the various countries to write in the home languages.
    This was also betfair's own system at the time, with regional bloggers writing various sports news and stuff.
    I believe that's the way to maximize the effectiveness of a "justice movement".
    But as I said those guys must have been already pretty disappointed with the result of their effort and there was no continuation of any kind.

    Whether it will have any effect this time remains to be seen.
     
    Bobajobber likes this.
  4. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    @cosmicsports I was surprised to read your above because i have made many posts on the JFP forum and all have been instant with no wait for moderation.I do agree its a great shame that the forum does not attract more activity. Imo the owners objectives are sound and genuine but they need our support to effectively implement.The last time i spoke with the principle he advised that they now have 1,000 reg supporters but as you say far fewer who use the forum.
     
    blackcat and Bobajobber like this.
  5. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    Maybe because it's my first day. I don't know.
    Anyway I counted the forum membership but perhaps overall they are doing better.
    I did make some shares too.

    Anyway, the question the authorities-bookies etc always ask is this "how many are they ?".
    If we are too few then we are "astroturfers".

    My Greek experience of justice for punters was full of "asymmetric events", crash-banged really. We were attacked by both the left and the right (or what seemed to be the left and the right).
     
    Bobajobber and mick like this.
  6. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    blackcat and Graeme like this.
  7. rpjd99

    rpjd99 Colt

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2012
    Messages:
    639
    Likes Received:
    528
    Graeme, mick and markfinn like this.
  8. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    Cheers Ray for the above.In the past when i have opened a new on line account free bets or promotions have never been the reason (although fair dues i can understand the attraction for many and why not).What has really piddled me off is being made to jump through hoops when daring to attempt to withdraw winnings.When we open the account and make a deposit via our debit card this is taken with no fuss.The complex frustrating and time consuming verification process used by some when we then ask to withdraw is not needed under Law and is clearly a sad attempt to delay payment.
     
    Graeme likes this.
  9. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    I wonder who can challenge state irregularities.

    In Greece we have this law:
    If your ticket wins over 100 euros for one unit then betting tax is applied.
    It's a crazy law because they don't say 100/1 or 200/1 etc ...
    So in horses the unit is 50 cents and that becomes effectively 200 to 1.
    In football the unit is 25 cents and the tax limit becomes 400 to 1.
    In pick six the unit used to be 3 euros so tax limit 33 to 1 !
    That's crazy because they ought to have said "tax limit is X to 1" which is simple.

    Now a fellow wins 123 euros on Tuesday at Ascot.
    It was the St. James's palace stakes, Barney Roy - Lancaster Bomber (Churchill 4th).
    The decimal price was 41.
    So for 50 cents it is 20.5.
    That's way below tax, but they tax him 3 euros !
    We ask for explanations, eventually they said something to the effect "we tax foreign races when it is over 100 euros, irrespective of units !".
    That on the face of it is irregular because if the punter says "give me two 1.5s" he avoids tax.
    But it is also against the law. It does n't follow from any tax law. I ask has there been a change in the law and did you publish it in your website ?
    No change in the law they said.

    That's illegal.
    I took the issue to the gaming authority EEEP and also to the ministry of finance.
    I wonder what manner of justification they can dream up.
    I know they are capable of cooking up unbelievable justifications, only I can't think of one now.

    They did something similar in 2010, price reduction.
    That time I went to the racing company and said to them "give me the board's decision to read it".
    It was a national company and they needed an addendum to the law to reduce the prices.
    They say no, we 're giving you nothing.
    The funny thing in this is that it was the 8th of November of 2010 and from the 10th of November all public companies had to publish all their board decisions, because the public transparency law took effect.
    The clever lawyer of the racing company said "I caught you for 2 days, now buzz off".
     
  10. markfinn

    markfinn Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2015
    Messages:
    3,009
    Likes Received:
    5,779
    Who knows - you seem to - To me that a looks to be illegal - are companies are blaming the state for unfair reductions and then robbing you by keeping the excess - robbing you not at a gun point but at the take out - our complaints are not currently about government interference taxation, rather lack of government action in forcing the bookmakers to a get rid of the profit enhanced casino machines and get back to day to day unrestricted bookmaking. It look's as though these idea's are now gaining some traction - hopefully with the Tote up for evaluation some jobsworth will see a good opportunity for making a name for himself and actually get some legislation passed.
     
    mick likes this.
  11. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    I will find out.
    You see it's a two-front war.
    Companies doing arbitrary things from one corner, government taxmen in the other corner.
    You 'd be tempted to believe the socialists stand for justice, because they care for the people.
    You 'd also be tempted to think the conservatives stand for justice, because they are for free enterprise and against overtaxation.
    In practice the socialists say "we stand for justice on all matters except this one" and the conservatives say "we take your money".
    And it's not as if you won something and then they tax it.
    If you go out with a pram and you sell swiss knives, alarm clocks, lighters, russian dolls, you stand to make a profit of some 400 euros. So if they take the 100, bust it, you still have 300.
    Here they are taxing losses.
     
  12. markfinn

    markfinn Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2015
    Messages:
    3,009
    Likes Received:
    5,779
    upload_2017-7-2_14-6-26.png
     

    Attached Files:

    mick and ArkRoyal like this.
  13. blackcat

    blackcat Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,747
    Likes Received:
    2,285
    Hi @mick I'll join that forum today,have u read Geoff banks article today,made a great pt said if u had three people standing in front of the three same packet of crisps and one was 40p one 60 and the other person couldn't buy one at all would u think it was fair!!
     
    nicksar likes this.
  14. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    A fair comment except that based on my personal experiences Dear Geoff does not always practice what he preaches.To take his above example Geoff would sell me half a packet at 60p and the remainder at 75p being very aware that i would not buy at those prices but still being able to claim that he did not refuse to sell.!

    Glad you are joining JFP the more the better.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2017
    nicksar likes this.
  15. blackcat

    blackcat Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,747
    Likes Received:
    2,285
    thanks @mick have joined friend and forum, just waiting for access. ive also created an account with mr banks!! we shall see.
     
    mick likes this.
  16. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    It's a fact of life that punters don't like to become proactive in the face of the various injustices taking place, financial, sports integrity related and other.
    It is strange when one sees trade unions going on strike for such things as "solidarity with Nicaragua" and when one also sees huge processions of football fans in the streets if their team fails to deliver the goods during the transfer window.

    The political parties are also hostile, not only those with communistic beliefs who are naturally hostile but all.
    UK is something of an exception. We have the queen's stables, also Winston Churchill who said he wanted to see his horse first and bother about the war later. In recent years Robin Cook with his daily racing article in the Scotsman and Tony Blair with his famous broadcasted treble accumulator.
    In other countries it's a shame for a politician to have any sort of involvement. Have you ever seen a US president at the Kentucky derby ? Messrs Macron-Sarcozy at Longchamps ?
    But in UK too things seem to be problematic, because the betting companies are allowed to do as they please.
    They should n't really, because they are handling our money. They do not make something by themselves, sell it and therefore claim the absolute freedom to price it as they like.

    It's difficult to expect any improvement.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
    nicksar and mick like this.
  17. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    Punter apathy plays into the bookmakers hands.Its difficult to be sure but i suspect that the numbers prevented via punitive restriction are now into six figs and growing.If just 10% of those came together via JFP and acted collectively then bigger and more effective waves would be made.But even if my estimate is correct its still only a small minority of the millions who bet and imo we should also be attempting to get these on board.The message being you could be next.

    During the past 18 months on several occasions JFP have had TV company's pull out late Re running coverage of what is going on and this has been down to Bookmaker influence.Everyone now talks about how the Books own the RP from afar but there powers extend to many non racing areas of the media and it is only punter power via numbers which will or would negate this.
     
    nicksar likes this.
  18. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    RP has become like amateur site.
    Either that or they could n't pay for site maintenance and they had to hire a cheap firm.
    ATR too who rennovated their site two years ago, made it worse than it was (!) but not as bad as RP did.

    For me the major obstacle seems to be that the political parties always look forward to raise taxes.
    Both types of party behave the same and if you count the reds too, they look forward to close down all the rece tracks and be done with it, if ever in power.
    So the common bloke in the street will never do something hi senses his party bosses won't like.
    Other obstacles are of secondary nature.
     
    nicksar likes this.
  19. blackcat

    blackcat Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,747
    Likes Received:
    2,285
    i opened the account with geoff banks last week put 250 in had one bet which lost and now theyve suspended my account due to breach of some promotional offer i never had! you were right @mick
     
    nicksar likes this.
  20. blackcat

    blackcat Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,747
    Likes Received:
    2,285
    Good Afternoon,


    Your account with Geoff Banks has been suspended pending an investigation into possible abuse of our terms and conditions, particularly those of our promotional offers. Clause 19.5 of our Terms and Conditions state:


    19.5. Where any term of the offer or promotion is breached or there is any evidence of a series of bets/wagers placed by a customer or group of customers (e.g. where common betting patterns across the same fixture/markets have been identified across accounts), which due to a deposit bonus, enhanced payments, free and risk free bets/wagers, or any other promotional offer results in guaranteed customer profits irrespective of the outcome, whether individually or as part of a group, Geoff Banks reserves the right to reclaim the bonus element of such offers and in Geoff Banks' absolute discretion settle bets/wagers at the correct odds, void the free and risk free bets/wagers or void any bet/wager funded by the deposit bonus. In addition, Geoff Banks reserves the right to levy an administration charge on the customer up to the value of the deposit bonus, free and risk free bet/wager or additional payment to cover administrative costs. Geoff Banks further reserves the right to ask any customer to provide sufficient documentation for Geoff Banks to be satisfied in its absolute discretion as to the customer's identity prior to Geoff Banks crediting any bonus, free and risk free bet/wager or offer to the customer's account.


    You can find full Terms and Conditions of your Geoff Banks account by visiting Geoff Banks. Your account has been suspended and your online account is no longer active. Your account may be reopened on successful completion of our investigation, which will involve a more detailed verification check, to include compliance with Gambling Commission and AML edicts.


    You are required to submit Photo ID (Driving Licence/Passport) and Bank Account Statement showing deposit to Geoff Banks along with your name and address. For further verification we require your address in the form of a utility bill proving your current residential status, which must not be more than 4 months old, and finally your mobile phone utility bill. It would speed up any potential withdrawal requests if you would supply the four requested documents by return of e-mail.


    We thank you for your co-operation here.




    Kind Regards

    David @ Geoff Banks







     
    nicksar likes this.
  21. nicksar

    nicksar Mare

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2016
    Messages:
    2,002
    Likes Received:
    4,330
    You probably bet on a horse that several Banks account holders were wanting to back @blackcat Geoff talks a good game and his blog is a good read but the bottom line is that he's in the business of taking punters money off them.
     
    mick and blackcat like this.
  22. blackcat

    blackcat Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,747
    Likes Received:
    2,285
    I've posted over on justiceforpunters and the reply was that I've probably been caught up in the crossfire over a few people have had their accounts suspended re some promotional discrepancy
     
    mick likes this.
  23. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    @blackcat Re Banks required verification..............The truth of it is that under Law a bookmaker has no need to see bank statements or passport photos etc.It is a total piddle take and something which JFP are working on via actual meetings with the GC to get changed.Fair dues i do still have a profitable account with him ,used infrequently but was never made to jump through hoops when withdrawing winnings.Perhaps his MO in this respect has recently changed.
     
  24. markfinn

    markfinn Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2015
    Messages:
    3,009
    Likes Received:
    5,779
    Account Verification and Identification Required for UK Online Bookmakers | Online Betting UK

    Morning Mick - Basically its about hiding behind the money laundering laws - anyone who has tried to open a bank account recently will know the hoops that you have to jump through - The fact that only require proof of identity when paying out - ie not when depositing - says a lot about how successful they expect punters to be - which is zero expectation of paying out any meaningful sums. I thought Banks was better than this - but who knows
     
    mick likes this.
  25. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    I should think most punters don't bother to withdraw.
    In my case if it was that unexpected 6000 euro bonanza five years ago, or the 500 I won on Greek election day in 2015 (!) I would. But who cares about small sums ? We keep them in so we play.
    That of course is music to the ears of the bookies.
     
    markfinn likes this.
  26. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    Cheers Mark and the following copied from your link confirms..........................The precise ID methods vary between operators, some ask for much more than others. At the most basic level you will be asked for your name, a UK registered address and a payment method. If your payment method is a UK bank account registered at the same address then it is highly likely that this may be all that you need to provide. The betting site will then cross check your address against the electoral roll, if you are registered at this address then your account should be verified.
     
    blackcat likes this.
  27. blackcat

    blackcat Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,747
    Likes Received:
    2,285
    account reactivated and no apology just said they were complying with new GC guidelines! Bollox they accused me of cheating !
     
    mick likes this.
  28. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    Comply with GC guidelines when it suits and delay or refuse to pay winnings or even take a bet when it suits.The current B365 case underlines the fact that all punters should come together and the JFP Org is the best way to do so.I read recently that there are four million active UK punters and just 1% of us acting as one would greatly increase the chance of much needed changes.

    The treatment i have received from Bookmakers i have taken personal and i am not laying down for it, and i would urge all to start thinking likewise because the chance increases that you could be next.!
     
    blackcat likes this.
  29. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    I have important issue here.
    I 'm going to wait one more day, then I will write here about it or in the other forum.
    Maybe you can advise.
     
  30. blackcat

    blackcat Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,747
    Likes Received:
    2,285
    theyve emailed me again in answer to my initial reaction ie complaint, they say they have every right to request said documents but ive replied saying that wasnt the issue they had accused me of being in breach of promotional offer terms and conditions! they didnt like my twitter comments either!
     
    nicksar and mick like this.
  31. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    Well done you because the one thing they do not like when they mess on us is for many others to be informed.I still do not get this twitter- facebook thing but increasingly it appears the way to get a message across.
     
  32. blackcat

    blackcat Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,747
    Likes Received:
    2,285
    heres a couple of tweets to geoff.

    im in total shock at you, youre supposed to defend us and yet you suspend my account , i opened this week with small money , one losing bet.

    1. who are all these anonymous tweeters on my timeline? Can anyone tell me why they feel need to be anonymous? Perhaps they are film stars

      2 replies0 retweets1 like
    [​IMG]karen rimmer‏@krimmer2
    Replying to @geoffbanksbet
    well im not anonymous! and youve suspended my account for no reason at all! some promotion thing? one bet one loser and im history...
     
  33. blackcat

    blackcat Mare

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,747
    Likes Received:
    2,285
    he's even now on twitter insinuating that men are using wife / partner account as he says, " most girly accounts have the whiff of him in bonus land " unbelievably sexist :eek:
     
    mick likes this.
  34. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    I think less likely to obtain any bonus but more so just to get a bet taken.Some deploy sophisticated tracking software seeking any connections between restricted customers and new accounts.I have found that female helpers opening an account often receive a lower max take out at the start than males so yes sexist and yet another piddle take ,law break ? which they are allowed to getaway with.
     
    blackcat likes this.
  35. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    I copy the below from the JFP site.Posted by the principle while helping a punter to get his money back.

    When you begin to pursue things they are likely to quote terms and conditions to you that justify their actions. These probably would not stand-up in a court of law, so just ignore them. Feel free to tell them that you are in contact with us. This is not certain to help, but we are finding that companies know they cannot just 'walk all over' people if we are involved.
     
  36. cosmicsports

    cosmicsports Filly

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Messages:
    428
    Likes Received:
    248
    I believe the way technology has progressed through the years worked against the punters.
    In the 19th century who would use a tote ?
    If a bookmaker said give me your money and I 'm going to divide it proportionately, they would n't buy. They 'd say he was a cheat.
    If he said I 'm paying 5 to 2 then of course you 'd believe - given that the bookie possessed a modicum of reputation.
    Eventually the bookie model more or less prevailed, even though in the meantime the Australians invented the totalizator.
    But the type of problem discussed here is the result of the absence of accurate bet matching and nothing else.
    There should be a law to force all those companies make their platforms technology compatible, giving them the necessary time to adjust. So it's a political issue.
    Other than that they should of course continue to cooperate with BHA, FA, Michel Platini to find the real match fixers.
     
  37. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    An interesting read on the JFP forum.A member was under paid by £225 because Corals deducted the wrong R4 amounts. Basically using the n/r prices at time of announcement when there own rules state it should be done via the prices at the time the bet was accepted. When the customer pointed this out to them he got no joy so took it to the IBAS who found in his favor and the £225 owed has now been paid.

    As he noted how many other customers have been short changed in this way and how much are they owed. ?
     
    markfinn likes this.
  38. valiant thor

    valiant thor Yearling

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Messages:
    191
    Likes Received:
    314
    Happened to me a few week ago, just basically ignore you.
    Law unto themselves bunch of legalised thieves.

    Thank you for requesting to chat live at Ladbrokes. We will be with you shortly.
    Samuel: All feedback is appreciated, please CLICK HERE at the end of our chat session to fill out a quick feedback survey!

    Hi, you are speaking to Samuel in the Sports department, how can I help you today?
    Player28643: why have I been charged 50p in the pound on my r4 in race 16.45 @ Ling
    Samuel: Bear with me one moment please whilst I check your account.
    Samuel: Can you confirm your bet number from the race16.45 @ Ling?
    Player28643: O/0189976/0001458
    Samuel: Thank you. I'll look into this for you.
    Samuel: Thank you for waiting.
    Samuel: I have reviewed your bet, There was a dead heat between 1st place and a Rule 4 deduction for 4 horses being a non-runner. Which was why there was a 50p charge.
    Player28643: it wasnt a dead heat
    Samuel: My apologies, no there was no dead heat.
    Samuel: But the Rule 4 of 50p was applied, Which was correctly paid out at £81.25.
    Player28643: R4 pre 7.15.50 40p
    Player28643: r4 4 pre 8.28.27 20p my bet was placed at 7.26.32 so r4 @ 20p was applicable
    Samuel: I understand due to the time the bet was placed, I will then forward this bet to be reviewed again regarding to the rule 4.
    Samuel: I have sent the bet over for further review between my supervisor and settlement team, This can take some time before they can respond back to us.
    Player28643: its ok Ill wait
    Samuel: It can take anytime from the next 30 minutes to a few hours. I have made notes to this, You can come back onto live chat for the update/ confirmation of the settlement by then.
    Samuel: But Is there anything else I can help you with today ?
    Player28643: what is the conversation number to quote
    Samuel: The session ID is 62987577351.
     
    mick likes this.
  39. mick

    mick Dam

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    11,868
    The problem is always that customer care are the cannon fodder.Needs must i can be tenacious but whenever i have been subjected to pathetic account restrictions i have never been able to get past CC and engage directly with the so called head of trading who has made this decision.Imo the latter are cowards who hide behind the CC skirts.
     
    valiant thor likes this.
  40. valiant thor

    valiant thor Yearling

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Messages:
    191
    Likes Received:
    314
    Hi Mick
    In my case its only £18.75 but do this on a regular basis over all your clients and It works out to be a pretty penny:mad:
    Are the R4's posted up anywhere by a reglatory body or are they just left up to the bookie ad hoc.
    as far as I know only B365 give you the info.
     

Share This Page